Whether you’re a seasoned pro or just starting out – printing is something that every Graphic Designer should be clued up on. It is the basis of where so many design principles come from, our history, our future? So why have Graphic Design Colleges failed to teach even the basics? With print making a HUGE comeback in all areas, are Graphic Designers being short changed in their schooling?
In the firing line this week – 10 things Graphic Designers NEED TO KNOW about printing.
From the classic charm of letterpress to the mind-blowing wonders of digital, get ready to dive into the colorful world of print. In this episode of The Angry Designer, the pulp loving purists take you through their Top 10 guide, Graphic Designers must-know about printing.
Massimo: [00:00:00] Yeah. People forget that. Yep. Okay. You can get coded paper, which is, you know, it's got coded, it's shiny. Mm-hmm. And boy does color pop on that, right? Uncoated. Yep. Absorbs the paper. Yep. Colors get flat. Yeah. On that. Right? Right. You've got satin, which is a nice in between, but things don't shine on Sha Satin.
Massimo: Shotton Shotton. William,
Shawn: I mean a sound like Sean Connery there
Massimo: you're listening to the Angry Designer where we cut through the industry bold to help frustrated graphic designers survive and thrive.
Shawn: Well, ah. Hey, how's it going? It's going great, my friend. Can I, can I pour
Massimo: you a be. I would like one of these. Today we are drinking something very special. It's called Look at.
Massimo: Legend. Legend. Not legend. Legend, but Legend. Legend and not French. You know, we were trying to figure [00:01:00] out, it could be French, but not really. But the story behind here is that this amazing bourbon. Take a look. Take a look. Pretty fancy. Look at that. Nice. So this fancy bourbon was actually comprised or made up from two bourbon legends.
Massimo: Oh, okay. So these guys, the mix masters, they came together and to create one truly unique bourbon. Mm. Now sadly, it's been a long week, so I can't read this. So that says they've made the type Typhon really small. Holy god. I'm thinking this is like, Six, eight point. It's probably six point, right? Mm-hmm.
Massimo: However, it's Kentucky Strait Bourbon. Yeah. You know, partially finished in wine. And Sherry Cass caskets again, CAS ca caskets. Not a casket. I'd rather not drink. Bourns been in the coffin. Now, is that pre
Massimo: post corpse show? You find out. Post corpse. Of course. Our
Shawn: caskets are freshly dug up. We don't even clean them.
Shawn: We make our bourbon with [00:02:00] caskets. With a wino inside. You get the, you get the extra flavor. Oh God. Oh,
Massimo: Cass Caskets. Cass
Shawn: Cas people. I knew that was wrong, but I was saying cheers to you. Cheer to my friend. Cheer. Salu. Salu. Wow. See,
Massimo: that's really good. So legend. Okay. You see these two people are, that come together to create something.
Massimo: It's nice, nice little burn at the end. No,
Shawn: it's just like a, it's warm. It's just like a. Ooh. I know, right?
Massimo: It's delicious. That is wonderful. There's so much flavor on this. I like that. Decent price. It's like a mid-price, you know? It's nothing crazy. It's not in the high end, but you know, it's far from the cheapest stuff there.
Massimo: Yeah. But it's really, really good. Oh, I like that. It is interesting, right? However, the mistakes on the label of courses, they made that type two damn small.
Shawn: Exactly. Accessibility. Accessibility, people accessibility. Geez.
Massimo: But yeah. No, it's
Shawn: very tasty. Yeah, it's really good. I like that.
Massimo: And so I guess our topic today mm-hmm.
Massimo: Is similar, right? Very much. We're talking about something very legendary today. Yep. We're [00:03:00] talking about the most awesome format. Yep. Print. Yes. Right. And, and again, old school. Legendary old school. We're taking this back, old school today. Yeah. This label, this brand, and now the topic, right? Mm-hmm. All very legendary.
Massimo: Yes. This whole thing came about. Okay. Yeah. Because we have been interviewing lately mm-hmm. To add a new person to our team. We've been interviewing some kids straight outta college. Yep. Some other ones who've been at it for a couple years. Right. And, um, horrible, horrible, horrible reality here. Mm-hmm.
Massimo: Okay. One of the questions on our interview, and we have a whole bunch, we have fun with our interviews. Right. We really do. We ask a whole bunch of ridiculous questions just to gauge their personalities, see if there's a culture fit as well. Yep. And one of the questions that I asked everybody, I'm like, I'm sure you know this, but.
Massimo: What does C M Y K stand for? None of our interviewees this year knew what the fuck CM Y K stood for, not one. And the thing that's shocking is some of them were straight outta college in the sense that like they only had a college [00:04:00] portfolio. We were looking for a junior. I was just like, don't they teach you this in school?
Massimo: Yeah. And they were like, oh, isn't that like colors like has to do with like, Colors. Right? And I'm just like, are you fine? I'm shocked and I'm huge disappointed. Yes. You know, incredibly disappointed here. Yeah, because I get it. Like, I mean, while print might not be huge like it used to be, print is still a really crazy active part of this space.
Massimo: Big time, right? And we're in the B2B space. Yep. It's huge. But you still see it everywhere in the retail space, the B2C space. Yep. You see it in large format, like it's everywhere IT format. Yep. So how the fuck does college? Not teach, you know what they said? They said, oh yeah, well we did have a, a print course.
Massimo: Oh. So out of their three years it sounded like they had one course, print course one semester. And I mean, again, like to us when I went to college, print was every single, there was some component that, was
Shawn: it print Exactly. Right now. Mind you, in all fairness. Yeah. Yeah. There was, I know where you're gonna say, go ahead.
Shawn: Yeah. There was [00:05:00] no such thing as, there wasn't any other formats right there. Well, no,
Massimo: we, we had it, I mean, when we were there it was kind of dig, the digital format was starting. Oh, it was, it was starting, but, but you're right. Yeah. In all fairness, not to where it is now. Mm-hmm. But to completely abandon this absolutely
Shawn: ridiculous it, at the very least.
Shawn: Yeah. It should be mentioned a lot more often, not just in the course, over a semester. It should be kind of, Baked into every project, should it not? Yes, absolutely. It should be like, okay, we're gonna do this. The, you're gonna do a brochure if you're gonna do, cuz I'm sure kids are designing brochures.
Shawn: Absolutely. Right. So what's the endgame with this? Do the professors just think, oh, well put it out into the ether and
Massimo: see what happens? And I'm kind of disappointed because the professors, and I know some of the professors of that course, and they're, they're older in the sense of they've been on the print side and now they've potentially made it over to the digital side.
Massimo: Right. So the fact that they could, like, I mean, print and design have got such a rich history together. Oh yeah. It breaks my heart to see that. It's just like they couldn't answer the most. Basic question. What the fuck [00:06:00] is C M Y K? Wow. Right? Yeah. And it wasn't until we were talking to a friend of ours, Dave Hopkins.
Massimo: Yep. Who runs the Print Design Academy. Mm-hmm. You guys should check it out. He was interviewing us on his podcast. Yes. The Quickie podcast. Yep. It's another graphic design podcast. Really good. And again, yeah, so he was actually telling us about his new initiative, the Print Design Academy that he's been running for a bit.
Massimo: And basically that, that there's this component missing in education. And, and it's the print education, right? Mm-hmm. He's a, he's a print guy. He, he loves print. He educates print in his Instagram. Yeah. And then from there I'm like, there's no way. Like, you know, so he's out in bc Yeah. And I was thinking, okay, maybe those guys out there just don't have print, you know, they're in the middle of fucking trees everywhere, but maybe they wanted to save them, not grind them up into pulp like we do out here in Ontario.
Massimo: And, um, and so I'm like, no, there's no way. But it wasn't, you know, after hearing that and then interviewing the people we did, I was just like, holy shit. Yeah. Like he is so bang on. Yeah. I get it. Like, I mean, print isn't what it used to be anymore, but it's a huge hybrid between the two. Yes. Right? Yes. Like you can't run from it.
Massimo: Like, [00:07:00] okay, our clients are b2b, right? Mm-hmm. And print is so active in the B2B world because granted it might be only a third. Mm-hmm. Versus how it used to be two thirds or, or three quarters. Yeah. But I mean, you've got trade shows. Yep. Which have. All kinds of print. Large print. Yep. They've got, you know, like business cards, simple prints, screen print, every kind of printing imaginable is being used at trade shows.
Massimo: Yeah, right. And how are these people graduating Graphic design without knowing Print? Huge disappointment.
Shawn: Huge, big time. Yeah. You, you know, the funny thing is, is like you, you're almost spa I'm starting to, to come on board with you about the education thing, right? Like, I don't know whether it's.
Shawn: Post-secondary education is a worthwhile thing. If they're not teaching stuff like this, if they're not teaching
Massimo: this anymore, I mean, you should come outta college knowing this, knowing enough, yes. That you can, at least if somebody asks you, what the fuck is c m Yk? Because somebody will, you can answer that.
Massimo: Yes, yes. Because they're gonna have to run. And again, these aren't just kids who, who were learning about design is just a small part. These were graphic design Yeah. Students. Yeah. So, [00:08:00] so I'm shocked and I think, you know, not, not to blaming them cuz they're design skills, we're all bang on. Yeah. Yeah. It's good.
Massimo: The teachers, the curriculum doesn't teach print like it should. Yeah. So by no means are we trying to step on. Dave's toes? Nope. I, I support his cause 100 Big time. Percent big time. Um, but what we are covering today is we're gonna give you a list of 10 things Okay. That all graphic designers absolutely should know.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. At a bare minimum Yes. About printing. Okay. So if you're newbie or you're just kind of got into the space or a couple years into the space, this is totally relevant. Yep. If you've been doing this for 20 years, ah, stick around for some of the laughs. I'm sure you know, this is good to brush up on.
Massimo: Right. And you can nod your head and be like, Hell yeah, I get that. I get that.
Shawn: Right. Yes. Even in this, even being, having been in this space for as long as I have, I'm still, uh, there's some things I'm, I'm learning here, so this is good. Wow.
Massimo: I know, right? Sean came from a newspaper background. Yes, exactly.
Shawn: That's all print. Yeah. Well, it used to be anyway, so [00:09:00] Yeah. Totally. So,
Massimo: so, wow. If you actually are kind of tipping
Shawn: your hat to some of this. That's right. Yeah. Well, well, it's been a long time. Yeah. Since I've, you know, but yeah. That was like right into the deep end. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Really You could not know what C M Y K was.
Shawn: Oh my God. In the newspaper industry.
Massimo: Geez. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, you know, the Heidelberg press would literally reach out from the clouds and slap you in the head if you're like, sorry, sir. Sorry.
Shawn: Oh, dear, you. All
Massimo: right. All right, so then you know what, with that being said, yeah. Okay. Let's start with the most basic of basics, okay?
Massimo: Okay. C m, YK versus rgb, motherfucker versus spots. Okay. So. C M Y K. Yep. Stands for cyan, magenta, yellow, black? Yes. Okay. These are the four basic colors. Mm-hmm. That reproduce on print in every, like every image that you see imaginable. Yep. Okay. So you're opening up a magazine, you're opening up, you know, you.
Massimo: Often a lot of the new shirts, no bad example of the shirts, but you know, a magazine or a billboard or [00:10:00] anything you see outdoor or anything you see in print. Yep. Okay. Chances are, has been printed in C M Y K right now. Granted the technology's come a long way. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Because you know, often they'll have low cyan and highs.
Massimo: Cyan, low magenta. Oh, it's, it's now become, like the press process has actually gotten much bigger, but Wow. The thing you have to remember, okay, is cyan, magenta, yellow, black. Yes. Basically reproduce every single color that you see on a printed surface. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Now, In contrast, R gb. Mm-hmm. Stands for red, green, blue.
Massimo: Yeah. Okay. And this is anything that you see digitally, whether it's on your phone, whether it's on a computer? Mm-hmm. On your car screen, right? No, even that, I mean even LCDs or like tv. Yeah, absolutely. Your TV. Everything digitally or backlit is R gb red, green, blue. Right. Okay. Yeah. However, there is, there, there is that outliner here called the spot color.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Okay. And this doesn't live in the RGB world, but this does live in the c m Yk world. Okay. Right. And what a spot color is, is an [00:11:00] individually mixed color. Okay. Which, you know, globally, everybody knows the term Pantone. Yes. Although Pantone is not. Just the spot or, or spot All. Not all spot colors are Pantone colors.
Massimo: Right. But the idea here is that a spot color is an extra layer, an extra, you know, another pass. Another pass of color. Yes. On the press, so often you'll get C M Y K plus a spot color or two or three. Yeah. And possibly some sort of special coating, whether it's a shiny coating, a flat coating, and aqueous coating.
Massimo: Yeah. But the reality is a spot color, um, is used. If somebody on a brand absolutely wants their 100% brand color and they don't want to budge and they're rich and they're, and they're rich as fuck, cuz it always costs more money because it's gonna cost you. Yeah. But it's also a spot color. That plate could also be like a metallic or a hit, a metallic or something like that.
Massimo: But again, so the spot is like that, that. Fifth or sixth or seventh outlier for the C M Y K? Yes. Okay. Yep. So first and foremost, c m Yk. Mm-hmm. Versus rgb. And then you [00:12:00] can throw in the, the spot color and maybe my order's off there. But you understand how that whole world works? Yep. Okay. Yep. So good colors, number one.
Massimo: Number two. Okay. The different. Printing methods. Mm-hmm. Okay. Huge importance. Okay. Because they all have different purposes and this is what people need to understand. So although there is, you know, this list does go a little bit larger. Mm-hmm. When it comes to print machines, they basically are broken down into four categories.
Massimo: Right. Okay. You've got your offset. Yep. You've got your digital printing. Mm-hmm. You've got screen printing. Yep. And then you've got large format printing, which is kind of a mix of some of these. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So first and foremost, Offset. Offset. Or lithography. Or offset litho, right? Yep. So this is a process that uses metal plates?
Massimo: Yep. Okay. The plates are covered with ink, right? The ink then gets transferred to the paper. Mm-hmm. Okay. And it's those giant traditional machines that you've seen over and over. And they could also be smaller machines too, the smaller presses. Right. They, they could be the size of a room. They could be the size of a small house.
Massimo: Yeah. Okay. Oh yeah. But reality is, it was the offset [00:13:00] litho that changed the world. Yeah, because it. Finally allowed print to be to happen in mass volume. That's right. Right. And started printing books and all of a sudden everybody started becoming more literate cuz they could read. It was more accessible.
Massimo: Okay. Because you could get a book. You could get a book. Right. And it didn't cost, you didn't have to be a rich family to have one. Right, exactly. So it was, it's always been around. Mm-hmm. Okay. And it still is around, it just has its advantages. Yeah. Okay. Because there was so much setup involved. In an offset press.
Massimo: Right. Your volumes are generally a thousand or more units. Right. Okay. If it's like a thousand, you know, something small like, um, you know, a thousand postcards and stuff, maybe they might do a gang run and put that on digital. Yeah. But when we're talking like a thousand brochures or a thousand, 2000 letterheads, 5,000, this, it's generally taken to an offset press.
Massimo: Yes. Okay. Yeah, because again, While the setup cost is a one time cost. Mm-hmm. The price per unit comes down with volume. Right. Okay. You're printing up two, three, 500,000, 200. You know, at that point it's like 90% of the cost is is print number one. Yeah, that's right. And everything else after [00:14:00] that is cheaper.
Massimo: Cheaper. Right. Because it is, there's so much to do to get it to press. That's true. So that's offset printing. Okay. It has its advantages. Still has its place. Mm-hmm. Okay. Yep. But if you only want a hundred, you know, a hundred items, it's not where you want to go. Yeah. Where you want to go. Is the next level, which is called digital printing.
Massimo: Right. Digital printing had a huge impact. Mm-hmm. On offset. Right. Okay. And it was great for our space. And I remember when digital printing was being introduced because for the longest time, your options were either an offset press mm-hmm. Or you had to have a laser printer. Okay. Laser printers were expensive.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Okay. To run, if you wanted, you know, a hundred units of something, man, every page would cost you like $3. It got really fucking expensive, right? Yeah. And you could only get up to an 1117 size, right? Yes. A tablet size. That's right. So when digital printing came in, it was basically like a large. Laser.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Right. It could do better quality stock. Right. It could do lower volumes. And granted, the cost per unit still was higher than offset. Mm-hmm. But you didn't have to print a thousand at a time. Yes. Yeah. Right. If you had a trade show [00:15:00] that weekend and you only needed 50 of something mm-hmm. Or a hundred of something, it made.
Massimo: The overall cost cheaper. Yep. Okay. So while a hundred of these, you know, postcards or a hundred of these brochures may have cost you 300 bucks. Mm-hmm. If you had to take it to offset for that same show, it would cost you 3000 and you'd be stuck with 950 after the show. Exactly. That you'd never go through.
Massimo: Exactly. And this was a common thing. Yeah. Right. You'd have boxes and boxes of printed stuff. Yeah. They'd never use that. You'd never use, cuz everybody would then they, they would always print more, right. To get the price down.
Shawn: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And they
Massimo: would just sit there. You'd have boxes that sat there for years of like, that's why you see printed shit for years after.
Massimo: Right. So digital printers, they use ink chatt or sometimes lasers. But the idea is it, Basically puts this, not ink, but like this funny kind of application or I, it's not real ink, like offset ink. Yeah. But it puts it on the paper. Yeah. Right. Use it. So it's very much like a large laser printer, if I had to put it that way.
Massimo: Right? Yes. But again, the nice thing about digital printing, okay, that offset struggles [00:16:00] with is you could also number items, right? Like that was the big thing that you could do variable. Data printing on a digital press. So you could customize if you had a hundred mailers that went out or a thousand mailers.
Massimo: Okay. It might cost more, but you could, because you could print with an Excel file attached to it. Right. Everyone could be personalized. Oh, so you'd get a postcard. So when you get a postcard in the mail or junk, mailman's got your name on it. Yeah. It's digital printing track. Right, because they're actually putting your name on it.
Massimo: Right. So it has its advantage of course, right? Yeah. But ultimately advantage quantity, you can go smaller. Can't go that big. Yeah. Because often I still think that the biggest sizes I've seen is like 20 by 30 inches. Like they're not massive. Right. So you have to get creative. But yeah, there is. So it has a place.
Massimo: Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Third option. Okay. Screen printing. Oh yeah. Okay. So screen printing uses a mesh screen to transfer the ink to some sort of surface. Okay. Screen printing, you see used on t-shirts, screen printing you see on [00:17:00] skateboards, on, you know, materials that you know don't necessarily fit in the press.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Right. And just because they're not paper. Okay. You can do screen printing on paper because often posters. Yes. Fan posters and stuff. Yes. We went to Hatch. Hatch, that's right. Yeah. In Nashville. I should have wore my shirt. Right. Oh, you should have worn a Hatch shirt. So we went to Hatch Printing, which is one of the oldest printing presses in Nashville.
Massimo: Yep. And they were screen printing. Mm-hmm. Right. So what did they say? They only had up to four colors on a poster. Yes. Okay. Yep. And again, so what it would do is it would actually, you'd have your screen, you'd have your basic cutout on the screen. Mm-hmm. And then you. Individually are pulling ink across that screen to get stick on the paper.
Massimo: So it's great. But it's limiting of course, right? That's right. Because high volume it doesn't do very
Shawn: well. Forget it. Yeah. You'd be there all frigging week doing it. You know
Massimo: what happens when you have t-shirts in like the thousands? That's interesting, right? Because that's, you know, the screen printed.
Massimo: Yeah. But I don't know enough about that. That whole world. I know the small print shirts runs right, of a couple hundred units here or there. Yes. Yes. I wonder what happens when it's mass volume. I would assume
Shawn: that there's, it's probably the [00:18:00] same process, some kind of. Mechanical item that probably swipes all, you know, there's gotta be some, but it's
Massimo: gonna function the same way, right?
Massimo: Yeah. Oh yeah. The difference is, the difference is screen printing utilizes. Mostly spot colors. Yes. Right. And there are spot colors layered on top of spot colors, so that's why T-shirts like this. Like what? Sean has a very distinctive look to 'em. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So that's screen printing. Mm-hmm. And last but not least, you have large format.
Massimo: Printing. Okay. Now questionable if that fits into this world or not. Yeah. But the reality is we are dealing with large format printing all the time. Mm-hmm. Whether you're doing banners that are sitting in front of somebody's business. Yep. Whether you're doing a sign, whether you're doing a wrap for a vehicle, you know, large format printing has its place in all of this because it's different enough that people need to know what the hell it is.
Massimo: Totally. So large format printing is great for billboards and for signs and for vehicles and, and or the wraps that go on the vehicles. Mm-hmm. And basically, It's just like a really big ass ink jet printer. Yeah. Okay. On [00:19:00] different, you know, materials, whether it's vinyl, whether it's paper. Right. You can get really creative with this stuff.
Massimo: The color is fantastic cuz you can get specialty inks Yep. Put into these things. Mm-hmm. They can cut them themselves. Yep. Right. Like they can actually have built-in cutters, you know, so you can get the right size and shape. But the thing is, you know, it's suitable for big applications. Yeah. Okay. But it's slow.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Okay. Now we have utilized large format printing in so many different ways. I remember early on in Zed Factor, we had to create, we had a huge pitch for Canadian Tire of all places. Oh wow. And it was, we were basically, we, you know, we represented this company that made paintballs, right. Oh, paintball, guns, paintballs.
Massimo: Right. And so we had mocked up these. Full size packages. Oh. To show them how amazing they looked. This, that, right? Mm-hmm. Well, this was back before digital printing was even a thing, and these packages were massive. Huge, right? They were huge. Yeah. Because these packages were probably about like three feet wide, you know, 12 inches high, and they were all four sides.
Massimo: Fucking impossible, right? Yeah. So what we did is we created them flat. Yeah. You know, the [00:20:00] digital file. Right. And then we got them printed in large format printing. Mm-hmm. And then we had them, you know, like coded. Right. And then we cut them out and we folded them all together and created these 3d. So I mean, again, we were able to use it in a different sort of format, right?
Massimo: Because again, it was perfect. And we've done that even recently where it's just like it was too big for the digital press. There's no other way to do it. And it's just like, Send it large format, cut it out and assemble it. Yeah. And it needs a perfect opportunity for this. It worked out great. Awesome. So large format has a huge part in this.
Massimo: So think of that. That's four of the most popular different printing methods. Okay. Right. Offset digital screen and large format printed. Yeah. Cool. Yeah, that's awesome. Moving on to number three. That's great. Okay, so this one is interesting. You've got dpi mm-hmm. Versus ppi. Okay? Mm-hmm. So again, Dpi, ppi.
Massimo: Everybody's heard of dpi? Mm-hmm. Well, apparently not. Maybe not. Yeah, maybe not. People aren't hearing about C My son dot, so DPI [00:21:00] stands for DOTS per inch. Right. Okay. And it's printed resolution. Yeah. Okay. So it's dots per inch stands for how many dots there are in a, in a square. Inch, and that lets you know the detail that your printing is gonna have.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Okay. Ppi? Mm-hmm. Is pixels per inch. Okay. So pixels per inch is digital resolution. Yeah. And again, exactly the same concept. It's how dense or how many pixels there are within a square. Inch. Okay. Right. While the two of those serve completely different purposes, they're essentially the exact same thing.
Massimo: Right? They are a unit of measurement of how detailed or, or how high the resolution of something is actually going to be. Yeah. Okay. And again, it's like the higher the D P I. Always. Mm-hmm. The better quality the picture. That's right. Okay. So you gotta remember that the higher the DPI or the ppi, the more quality there's gonna be more detail.
Massimo: This works on both ways, right? If you have something that's very low, p i on screen. Mm-hmm. The picture's gonna be very low [00:22:00] res, jagged, almost like eight bit lights. Yes. You know, except worse than eight, unfortunately. And if something is printed in a low dpi mm-hmm. Right. It's looks jaggedy. It looks like, you know, you can tell when something low rez has been printed.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Because again, it's very jagged. It's jagged out. We'll get to that. But it's very, it is, it's very low res looking. Okay. And people are like, oh, what is, it looks so pixel pixelated, right? Yeah. So that is, we'll get to that in a second. Okay. Okay. But that's the difference between the two. Cool. Now, What are these resolutions?
Massimo: Ah, okay. This is number four on our list. Okay. Yeah. So obviously what are the common resolutions graphic designers should know about? Mm-hmm. Okay, so number one. Web, the resolution or PPI of Web. Okay. Is only 72 dpi. Yeah. Or ppi, right? It's only 72. And we're only gonna talk about dots, prints here because, I mean, again, they work so close, but 72, when you're building something and if you're building it and in Photoshop, it's like, well, what's the resolution?
Massimo: Gotta be. 72 DPI [00:23:00] size as is all it takes to show something to look fantastic. Perfect. On a monitor. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. They got those super high res monitors that they wanted you to double it in. Double everything. Yeah. And that's all, you had to double it and it would compress it, right? Yeah. Yeah. But again, you know, I think it was more of a sales pitch that wasn't worth it because I, I didn't notice anything.
Massimo: Yeah, I know. So 72 DPI is all it takes for an image to look fantastic online. Yeah. Is that good enough for print? No. Hell no. No. If you print, you print something at 72 DPI size as you're printing it again, you're right. It's just you're gonna be printing it a few times. Customer's not gonna be happy. Nope.
Massimo: It's just looks like ass. Yes. Okay. Print. Resolution is 300 dots per inch. That's right. Okay. So you need to get something four times as high. Mm-hmm. As digital. Okay. And again, and that's to get something nice Chris. Clear. Right. This is when something hits press. Yeah. Right now that's offset printing. Yep.
Massimo: Okay. If you were to go in the middle, cuz we talked about. Digital printing. Mm-hmm. Okay. Or lasers, [00:24:00] surprisingly enough, you can get away with something at 150 dpi. Right. With digital printing. Yeah. Okay. So technology is different. It's not gonna be as crisp, it's not gonna be as clear. Mm-hmm. But we won't force you to redo it.
Massimo: Yeah. Like if you had to actually do it at 72 dpi. Okay. Yes. So in order, Web is 72. Yep. Digital printing is 150. Mm-hmm. Is doubled. Offset printing magazines, all that is three 300 dpi. Yeah. So the trick question is, mm-hmm. What's the DPI for large format printing
Shawn: then? Well, I always thought it was lower res.
Shawn: You could get away with
Massimo: that, but so it's So that is the reality. It is. Is it? Okay. Okay. And to a point in the sense that. Billboards. Yeah. Billboards that you'd see off the side of a highway that are like 2, 3, 400 feet away. Yeah. Rank giant billboards. Yeah. I've heard of stories where they get down into the 32 dots per inch.
Massimo: 36. Oh, geez. Because you're seeing it three, four far away, feet away. Yeah. Right. Okay. Yeah. Now, the reality is because it's printed, if you were to [00:25:00] try to print that at 150 dots per inch full, Size. Oh
Shawn: God. You've been there forever. Your file
Massimo: size would be gigabytes giga. Your working file would be close to 10 gigabytes.
Massimo: Yes, and we had to do that recently, right? We did have somebody they insisted they needed at 150 D P I size as, and there's a billboard. His most ridiculous. Ask I've ever fucking had in my life. Right. Oh wow. We still only give it to him at a hundred dpi. Yeah, because even at a hundred dpi, the working file was almost 10 gigs.
Massimo: Oh, okay. So in that sense, but because it was, you know, you were seeing it from 30, 40 feet away, it's a different story. Yeah. We had another customer, however, Okay. Who we were building their trade show booth for. Mm-hmm. Now, with the trade show booth, people were gonna be walking up to it. Mm-hmm. Within 12 to 24 inches.
Massimo: Ah, okay. Soc. Exactly right. Because now we're closer to it. Yeah. We had to make it a bigger file. We had to be a higher DPI because Right. Again, if it's too low res, that's fine. If you're 10, 15 feet away, not a big deal. But yeah. But because they were so close, we had to [00:26:00] build, so where I'm getting with this is large format.
Massimo: It's variable. Yeah. Okay. And the reality is you have to take into consideration how close somebody's gonna be to the actual printed piece itself, right? Yeah. Right now, billboards, you can do 72 dpi, believe it or not. Yep. Because you're not gonna see a billboard closer than 30, 40 feet. And from that distance, it'll look fine, it'll look great.
Massimo: But if you're at a trade show booth and you're walking up to a banner stand or something. Mm-hmm. That banner stand has to be at least 150 dpi, right? At least. Yeah, banner stands. Yep. Okay. And then again, you got that range in the middle. Mm-hmm. Okay. So those are the resolutions to remember. Okay. 72, 1 5300, and then large output.
Massimo: There's a variable there. Yeah.
Shawn: Yeah. It's dependent on whatever the project is. Exactly, yes. Okay. Nice. Wow, that's really good. Very cool. On two, yes. Nuk
Massimo: Raster versus Vector. Oh, okay. I'm sure nobody heard the fucking difference of this. I'm sure nobody knew. Okay. They couldn't answer C yk, I mean, raster versus [00:27:00] vector.
Massimo: Come on. Okay. The difference between rasterized images and vector-based images? Yeah, so vector-based images are usually what is created from Illustrator. Mm-hmm. Right. Perfect example, right? Yeah. It's line art. Mm-hmm. You know, you can layer it. It's generally salt. You can put gradients and all that. Mm-hmm.
Massimo: But the reality is you can take an illustrator object. Okay. And you can make it as small as you know, to fit on a quarter. Yep. You can blow that bad boy up to fit in the side of a building. Yep. It'll be the same. Exactly. It's still crystal clear. Yeah, it's perfect because I guess the way it works is it's like mathematical and it's actually recalibrated and rebuilds the thing no matter what the size is.
Massimo: Right. Yeah. I learned that today. I didn't, I didn't know why it did that. Yeah, I wasn't sure either. That's, but that's how you know, that's why Vector works like that. Okay. Now you can't. Vector a photograph? Yes. Okay. You can recreate that photograph in a vector program. Mm-hmm. And, and kind of make it look, you know what, what it would like a, if you had to redraw on something in Illustrator, right?
Massimo: Yeah. Yeah. But again, it's vector based. Yeah. Okay. Now photos [00:28:00] are rasterized, or they're raster based. Mm-hmm. Okay. Mm-hmm. Raster based images have a fixed size. Okay. So it's something that's. 300 dpi, eight inches by eight inches. Right? Okay. Or 150 dpi, it's six inches and six inches, right? Mm-hmm. Raster based images has a fixed size.
Massimo: Yep. And dpi. Okay. Now what happens when you take a RA based image and you stretch it? Okay. Well, again, if you leave it as size as mm-hmm. It'll be fine. Mm-hmm. Nothing happens to you. It looks beautiful. Yeah. If you all in a sudden enlarge it a hundred percent. 200%. 300%. Mm-hmm. It starts becoming jagged.
Massimo: Yeah. It starts looking like a low res image that you found online and you zoomed in like two, three, 500%. Yeah. That's what's called izing. Right? Okay. When an image is rasterized and you're, you're zooming in and it's like, oh, it's too, it's because it's too low res to fit. Right. Okay. You can't just bump up the resolution.
Massimo: There's no mathematical evaluat.
Shawn: There's no knowing.
Massimo: It is what it is. It is what it is. Yeah. And [00:29:00] often you might be able to get away with bumping it up a hundred percent once, you know, and we have done that in a pinch. Yeah, I do. Sometimes it's, but you see it. I know. And you see what happens, right? Yeah, it does.
Massimo: It's not good. It starts, but once you start going 200%, 300%, man, it's an eyesore. And you can see that it just starts looking all jaggedy and fuzzy and, and you can start seeing things pixelate. Yeah. In the images. Yeah. So again, raster based images need to stay that size. Yeah. And that dpi. We're vector-based.
Massimo: You can scale these things to your heart's content and they're always gonna look crystal clear. Yeah.
Shawn: Now Photoshop has, has an awesome filter where you can take a high res file and it will double it.
Massimo: Like it, so it, yeah, it's, yeah. No, no, no. So the beautiful thing about. Ai Now this is And it is. It's their AI is ai.
Massimo: There are a lot of websites out there. Yeah. That you can put a low res image in there and it'll turn it high res and it'll turn it high res because it basically recreates it. It fills in the blanks because it knows what's supposed to be there. Okay, so [00:30:00] that's cheating. Yeah. That's not necessarily intentful for this conversation, you know, because again, what we're going of it is possible though, and we've used it in a pinch.
Massimo: Not in a pinch. We use it regularly because what happens, customers send you something. They're like, well, here, here's an image of our president on the golf course and it's in Word. And she's like, okay, well I can't really do much with that raster based image. Thank you very much. So then you can take it into this program, you can bump it up.
Massimo: And it actually does a pretty good job for that, right? Yeah, it does. But it gets to a certain point where it starts looking a little fakey and start seeing where it fills in certain parts, right? Yes, yes. Um, but often we'll get logos that way. In Word. Right. And it'll be Dr. And just as soon as you know that something's being delivered to you in Word.
Massimo: Yeah. Nine times outta 10. It's not an S V G vial. It is a raster based something or another that you have to then take and recreate.
Shawn: Exactly. Exactly. I The meme is true. Yeah.
Massimo: The meme, there's so much truth to that meme. Alright, so that's the difference between raster and vector based images. Cool. Okay.
Massimo: Yeah. So now. How do you [00:31:00] now onto number six. Mm-hmm. Okay. Now that you've got all this amazing knowledge that you're learning and it's building and it's building, it's building, yep. Okay. Yep. Now we're gonna just give you some ideas on, on how to use file types with all these, how do I save these? Oh, how do you save these?
Massimo: Let me tell you, Sean. All right. So first things first. I'm sure everybody's heard of a Tiff Yes. File. Okay. TIFF stands for tagged image file format. Oh, I don't, don't worry about that. You'll never need to know that. I've never asked anybody to iden to tell me what that acronym stands for.
Shawn: I always thought it was the Toronto International Film Festival, but of course,
Massimo: wasn't that only one F though?
Massimo: I think it was. It was right.
Shawn: Yeah. They just, but it had two. This is the film
Massimo: festival. I know, right? Funny. So it should have been T should have been two. Right. But. A TIFF file format. Okay. Yeah. Is a raster based file format, right. That is often used for high resolution images. Mm-hmm. Okay. High, because there's a fantastic compression technique there, right.
Massimo: L Z W or whatever compression that can actually take a giant file and render it down small, [00:32:00] similar to how would JPEG does. Oh, okay. Now, JPEG is also. A raster based file format. Yeah. But because the compression there is so, so extreme, it deteriorates over time. Yes. Right. Where a tiff won't, yeah. So a tiff traditionally was how images were saved when they were photos or you know, anything like that actually when, just when there were photos of some sort or another.
Massimo: Right. Okay. Now you also have. E p s. Okay. E Ps, you know, is known as Encapsulated Postscript, and this is generally what is saved out of Illustrator. Right. I believe it's also, and I hate to say this, what was saved out of ch Draw, wasn't it? I think ch Draw, you get exported as a e s file. Yes. But. The reality is what an E p S was, is primarily it's a vector based file, right?
Massimo: So it's ideal for logos, right? Easy placement, great for icons, right? Mm-hmm. It is a vector-based file. Mm-hmm. But as you all know, you can place ized images in there. Mm-hmm. Which is kind of cheating. Yeah. But we've all done it. [00:33:00] Again, I think I do more brochures in Illustrator than I do in the, in the programs like InDesign.
Massimo: I just don't touch any design guys. So what happens there is, you know, so then now you're getting a little tricky and you are getting a little messy. Yeah. Because now you've got a vector-based file that's, you know, incorporates a roster based image and everything that we said about RA images is true.
Massimo: And it's still, you know, just because you're putting it in an EEPs doesn't change the fact that it's still a roster based. Yeah. File. Yeah. I remember I, um, And we, we would've, our customers send us, you know, their logo in a tiff. Yeah. And I was like, oh shit, no, this isn't gonna work. Cause I need it bigger.
Massimo: Yeah. Do you have this in EEPs? They're like, oh yeah, hold on. Five minutes later they come back, they send me an EEPs, you open it up, and they took the tiff and they placed it in there. I was just like, You almost got me there, didn't you? Yeah. So unfortunately, you know, regardless, um, you know, an e p s has its place.
Massimo: Yeah. Right? And a raster shouldn't live in there unless you understand how raster actually works. [00:34:00] Yeah. Okay. Yes. You know, I think there's also the fact that epss can contain spot colors. Which is important because again, when you're setting up a certain file for press, oh, if a customer has a specific spot color, it keeps it, yeah, it keeps it right.
Massimo: And then you can assign a spot color and it'll keep that. So when they're creating the plates right, then it's always there. There's there's a fifth plate there for it. Absolutely. Okay. Gotcha. And then last but not least, You've got pdf. Okay. Ah, so these are the three basic, okay. This isn't for everybody, but these are the three basic, okay.
Massimo: PDFs, stand for portable document format. Okay. And it's kind of like the grandaddy of this all. Mm-hmm. It, it keeps everything in place. It's, in my opinion, the most preferred file format because it preserves fonts, it preserves. Images. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. It keeps vectors in place. Mm-hmm. It's when you save an e p s with all those images as a PDF when it goes to press.
Massimo: Okay. You know, it's, it's a lot more accurate representation of the original design than what an E p S would do. Right. And the nice thing about PDFs, Is it works across so many different platforms? Yes. It's [00:35:00] usually accepted PCs, max RIP files, like PDFs, RIP files can extrapolate every element on its own.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. So it's generally the safest format to hand things over with. Right. It's not magic. Yeah. If there's a roster based image in there. Right. If it's shit in Yep. It's shit out. Okay. Famous saying shit in shit out. Right. Yep. Same with the eps. But again, you know, the PDF has got so many more advantages and generally, you know, it's just good practice to save as a pdf.
Massimo: Yeah, right. And even as a vector-based image, even though you can't hand something over as an eps mm-hmm. However, some people's computers can't open an EEPs. Mm-hmm. But almost everybody's computer can use a PDF one way or another. That's right. Okay. Yep. So Tiff. E p, s and pdf. Okay, so that's number six.
Massimo: Beautiful. Number seven. Okay. Something very, very important that every graphic designer should understand. Mm-hmm. Do you outline fonts? Do you embed fonts, or do you just attach. Fonts to a file.
Shawn: Wow. Oh my God. Back in the old days, you had to attach.
Massimo: Isn't that funny? Right. [00:36:00] So as you know, you'll download a font from Google when it comes in like a T T F file, right?
Massimo: Yeah. And you're right. In the old days we would actually create the file. Yeah. We would pull in, here's the e p s. Yeah. Here's, here's the raster based image and here's the font. Right. Because the font wasn't always available and you know, across the board. Yeah. Just cuz I had a cool font that I downloaded doesn't mean Sean had it or the print shop had it.
Massimo: Right? That's right. Yeah. So there are advantages and disadvantages to each. Okay. Yeah. You didn't
Shawn: wanna be that guy that the film or the, the film house guy came to you and said, we don't have this such and such a fun. And you're like, Dammit. Oh,
Massimo: big amateur move there big Am. And we've all experienced it.
Massimo: Everybody's been there. Do you know what the funny thing is? I still have that happen here internally. No. Well, because sometimes people get, you know, they coming up with concepts, they turn on the Adobe fonts. Oh, right. Oh, I'm gonna use this font from Adobe. Well, I don't have it turned on. Uh, and for whatever reason, you know, because Adobe's so damn reliable, it never seems to work on my computer, this stupid Adobe font library.
Massimo: So I'm like, um, Can you [00:37:00] send me the font, please? And again, people have to attach that font. Oh, okay. Now that's attaching the font. Now this would all be resolved. Yes. If they outlined the font. That's right. Okay. So outlining what it means when you outline a font is you actually convert the font. To an object.
Massimo: Yep. Okay. So you get rid of all the font properties and boom. Then it becomes just like a logo. It's a vector piece of art. Yep. You can scale it, but it's in place. Mm-hmm. Disadvantages. You can't change it at that point. Yeah. You can't fix it anymore. Right. You got a typo kind of screwed. You're gonna have to go back.
Massimo: Yeah. So, Good practice is to always create your version with fonts. Yep. And then save a separate version outlined. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Good practice. That's right. Okay. You want to send something to a printer, do yourself a favor, create an outlined version of it. Save it as outlines and send that, cuz they'll never need to have the fonting.
Massimo: Exactly. Okay. Yep. There is the third option, which is embedding. Fonts. Mm-hmm. Okay. Now, when you do this as a pdf, if you save something as a PDF file, it [00:38:00] automatically does it embeds that font into the file. Yeah. So it doesn't convert it to outlines, but it embeds it. So when the printer uses it, opens it up and starts putting it through their RIP machine.
Massimo: Mm-hmm. Which will then convert this, you know, to the printing press. Right. It takes the font and uses it as is. Yeah. Right, because it's embedded. Right. Good format, good practice, you know? Yep, yep. Now again, how do you know which one, which one you want? Mm-hmm. To do? Okay. The answer is, it depends on the desired level of editability you want to pass on.
Massimo: Right. Okay. So, again, if you want to give them, and the final output, the ability to edit stuff, Okay. You wanna make sure that you give it to 'em in the easiest format. Mm-hmm. That they can edit, which is probably attaching the font. Yep. Right. Because again, if you embed it into something like a pdf, well, not everybody can edit a certain font in, in a pdf.
Massimo: Cause you need, it's tricky. It's tricky, right? Yeah. Yes. It's not ideal. Yes. Okay. So they'll have to open up your working file Yes. And change it there. That's right. So in that case, if you're handing over a word or an Illustrator document or a Photoshop document that [00:39:00] still has text in it. Yeah. And you want that text to be edible just in case to cover your ass.
Massimo: Yeah. Attach that font. To that file. Exactly. And as soon as you hit outline Yeah. It's a, a disaster. Yeah. Because you're doing your basic one at one font at a time. Yeah. You're deleting and manipulating. Yeah, I've done
Shawn: that. I know. I did it yesterday.
Massimo: I was like, gosh, I was cursing every minute. Why the fuck did I do this stupid outline?
Massimo: Didn't see it as a smile.
Shawn: No better. This was literally my day yesterday. I do, I do that all the time too. And it's just like you're like, Fuck. I know. Why did
Massimo: I do that? So I'm making up font, this is the word. And so I'm gonna grab a letter from here and a letter from here. Yeah,
Shawn: I know, I know. That's the worst up.
Shawn: And you know, the funny thing is, is Adobe makes it so easy with the collect for output. You know what I mean? Like it really does. Demonstrator does it, it's great. So literally you just press a button and it. Folders everything up. I mean like including the font. Yeah, including the font. Which is, which is really good.
Shawn: So like again, when back in the old days you'd have to go through your fonts [00:40:00] folder, find the hellvetica, find it and you know, copy and paste it over and then send it. It's so true, right? Yeah. Yeah. I know. It was just like, so this is so much easier. Ah, the good old.
Massimo: So again, so number seven, you know, outline fonts, embed fonts, attach.
Massimo: The answer here that you should know is it depends completely on how much editing you want to pass on to the next user. That's right.
Shawn: Alright. That goes for that raster based, uh, full a picture that you put in there too. Right, man, a hundred percent. That does. You wanna embed that motherfucker in there too.
Shawn: You right. Because the guy's gonna open it up. It's like file is not, is not
Massimo: there if you can't, right? Yeah. If you don't embed that, yes. That image file, and again, like you said, if you do collect for open it does automatically, but Yeah. But yeah, you don't wanna open something up and almost is like missing this file.
Massimo: Yeah. That square. And you know what it does or it, it puts the preview version,
Shawn: which is lo rez horrible. Yes. Yes, that's right. A quirk used
Massimo: to be horrible for that, right? Oh, that was the worst. Because it would be like, oh no, and you'd think it's there because it always showed you a [00:41:00] preview in low res and then you'd print it and it just came back looking like as it's like a thousand copies later.
Massimo: Dam it. I used to have boxes at home for the kids of paper to use. Oh yeah. Which was old print screw up runs. I was like, oh, there's a thousand I gotta reprint. Might as well turn the other side. Kids. Yeah. There you go. And kids, they're so damn selfish. I don't, I don't wanna use the backside it's used. Shut up
Massimo: use it. Just draw on the back of it.
Shawn: Ah, that's hilarious up. Totally, totally. Did you put the the put it to good use? Yeah. Right.
Massimo: All right. Number eight. Okay. Okay. Yep. Trim versus bleed versus safe space. All right. Okay. So these are three extremely important terms Yes. That you have to understand. Okay, so, right, the trim size is exactly, is the size of the paper.
Massimo: And you'll always see the trim line. Yeah. Okay. So, you know, no matter what, this is the size of the paper and I mean, this is [00:42:00] generally the size of the art board, right? Yes, exactly. So you create the art board, the edge of the art board is the trim of the paper. And we'll say eight and a half by 11. Just for arguments.
Massimo: Just for arguments, okay. Yeah, yeah. Now, Then you've got the bleed size. Well, let's say that, you know, your, your piece of art isn't white. It doesn't have a white background. Right. You're using a solid color to the edge, or you're su using an image to the edge. Right. Okay. Well if you take that piece of paper then, or that file and you send it through and it's eight and a half by 11 and they're printing it, Edge to edge on an eight and a half by 11 print.
Massimo: Well, what's gonna happen is there's gonna be slight shifts. Yep. To the left. To the right. Yeah. To the up. And they're just, they're, they're like a 16th of an inch. Mm-hmm. They're so small. Yeah. But what happens is you get printing pieces back and you can see a white strip on an edge or at the top, and I mean, nothing looks cheaper.
Massimo: Ooh. Yeah. Than when somebody sends something to print and you can see a little white edge. White edge. Right. Because the image wasn't set properly or the color wasn't set. Yeah. This is when. Bleed comes in. Right. Okay. So bleed is, you have to take that image and [00:43:00] you have to stretch it an eighth of an inch over each edge Yeah.
Massimo: Of that trim sheet. Right. Okay. So now when they do trim that sheet down or when they print it right, it's gonna have that, that you will get rid of that mysterious little white thin line that's all around the edges. Right. And I hated that. Yeah. So you can think of that as, you know, the trim that, so I guess the order would be bleed would be outside.
Massimo: Yep. It gets trimmed down to the trim size. Yep. And then you've got the safe area. Right? Right. Because when you're printing stuff on offset, you know, there's so many variables that happen. Pages can shift just a hair one way. Mm-hmm. Paper actually stretches. Mm-hmm. Going through a press. Right, right. Yeah.
Massimo: So, you know, things will shift a little bit here, a little bit there. So a safe area is generally about what, a quarter of an inch or an eighth of an inch, generally from the edge, yes. Inwards. Yeah. So you've got your safe area. Yeah. Then you've got your trim area. Yeah. Which is a little bit outside of that, and then you've got your bleed, which is even further.
Massimo: Yeah. So the safe area is basically, even if things shift slightly one way or another, yeah. You're still going to be safe. Whatever you put in there, that's your [00:44:00] critical stuff. That's your. Phone numbers, that's your, you know, your copy. Anything that you Absolutely. That's critical for the piece itself. Okay.
Massimo: So you gotta remember
Shawn: those and things like that will go to the edge kind of thing. To the bleed.
Massimo: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Right. Yeah. So those are the three. Now there is a fourth part to this. Okay. And I'm just throwing this as a surprise. Woo. Something called registration marks. Wow. Okay. So when you actually see, you know, your, your bleed and you see your crop marks on the outside, right.
Massimo: You know, the crops look like the little l shapes right? And it's, the crops signify, you know, where the paper's gonna be cut. Yeah. Okay. So you know how to work within, you'll often see a little circle with all, all four colors, right? Cross hairs with the four colors. Okay. These are registration marks. Okay?
Massimo: They're cross shape marks that, you know, are added to a design before they print. And what they do is when they align, All four layers on top of each other. Mm-hmm. They use the registration marks to keep them all aligned. Yep. Okay. Yeah. So again, what this does, it helps the printer line all the plates up.
Massimo: So items print [00:45:00] accurately, color-wise, the black hits black, how it's supposed to, it's perfectly aligned. Yep. But they use these registration marks mm-hmm. Every single time. So the registration marks are the crosshairs. Yeah. You know, they're also like the crop lines marks on the outside. Right. Yeah. And they use all of these together to kind of get you this perfect printed piece.
Massimo: Yes. Okay. Yep. So you've got trim. Versus bleed versus space. Yep. N with the outlier called the registration mark. Registration mark. Okay. Two more eyes. Oh ho. Two more guys. Two more that you have to remember. Two more things. There will be a quiz at the end. Yeah. Especially if you're coming in an interview over here.
Shawn: Okay. Yeah. I'm gonna be asking you. That's right. You will get that
Massimo: question. Tell everybody I know. Make sure you ask 'em this when you interview a graphic designer. Yeah, totally. All right. Number nine, paper sizes. Mm-hmm. Okay. You've got to know the basic standard paper sizes, okay? Mm-hmm. So, First off.
Massimo: You'll see a series B series paper sizes. I hated these and I never understood until this week where the hell they came from. Okay. But it turns out that they were an [00:46:00] ISO two 16 standard. Okay. And this is when you'd see a four or a six, because they were always there in the print dropdown. Yep. And I thought they were just there to mess me up.
Massimo: Right. I really, because I was like, no, no, no. I don't know what the hell that is. But again, They were an ISO standard, which again, ISO standard is, is a great thing globally. Yeah. Apparently nobody called North America and told them this. Okay. And you know, they're common in countries like Europe, Asia, Australia, yeah.
Massimo: Um, Africa, New Zealand, Latin America, basically everywhere, but North America. North America and the uk apparently so. Okay. I know. So, so this is all the A series and the B series. So it's paper sizes based on an ISO standard. Oh, okay. Okay. Now what we are familiar with, Is letter size. Okay? Yes. Letter size is pretty much the most common that you'll see in printers, you know, all over the place.
Massimo: Yep. Most common printed size, it's an eight and a half inches by 11 inches. Right. Okay. Yep. Eight and a half. The first size is always width. Mm-hmm. The second [00:47:00] size is always height. Right. So eight and a half. By 11. Yeah. You knew that that was a tall piece. You knew it was a vertical piece. Yep. If somebody was to say, no, it's 11 by eight and a half automatically you knew it was a horizontal piece.
Massimo: Yeah, a landscape piece. It was wide. That's right. First number is always width. Second number is always height. Yes. Okay. Yep. Then next, from letter size here in North America, apparently we have something called legal size, which is eight and a half wide by 14 inches. Hi. Yeah. Okay. I guess this is for legal doc, is that what it is?
Massimo: Well, I mean, I can say that the real estate documents that I sign are usually in that format. They are? Yeah, they are. They're always long. So maybe there is some truth to this. Yeah. As silly as that sounds. Yeah. But the nice thing about legal size papers mm-hmm. Is a 14 by eight and a half. Mm-hmm. Makes a really nice brochure, tri-fold.
Massimo: Right. Oh. Because it's just, it's just a good format. You can cheaply, inexpensively slap that together. And they're not too thin. Yeah. You know that it just, it looks wimpy. Yeah. It's actually good. Substantial size and because like an eight and half
Shawn: by [00:48:00] 11 is too
Massimo: big. Yeah. It's a little thin. No, it's a little thin if if you do it fivefold, right?
Shawn: No, sorry, sorry. Or 11 by 17. And 1117 would
Massimo: be a little too big for Cool. But a little bit too big in that sense. Right. Yeah. That's really cool. Kind of fun, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that's legal size. And then last but not least, Is the tabloid size and tabloid is 11 by 17. Right? So 11, 17, 11 wide, 17 all.
Massimo: Yeah. You know, and this is still very common within the laser printers. Right? Okay. So those are the basic ones. Yeah. Sometimes you get people customizing squares, but it's hard to find a standard square size piece of paper. Those are usually custom cut, right? Yes. But printers will accommodate for Square, huh?
Massimo: So again, you got the A series and B series, which is ISO standards globally, except for North America and the UK letter sized. Legal size and tabloid size and tabloid size. Okay. Yep. That's number nine. Nice. Last but not least, and you guys have to remember this, okay? Mm-hmm. The nice thing about paper Yep.
Massimo: Okay. Is it's so textured, it's so, you know, you pick up paper, [00:49:00] you feel it, you get this warmth, right? It's got texture, you grind the paper between your fingers. Mm-hmm. You smell that paper. Right? So, you know, that's the best part about paper. Yes. Okay. So you've gotta remember though. Every type of paper affects the print.
Massimo: Yeah. People forget that. Yep. Okay. You can get coded paper, which is, you know, it's got coded, it's shiny. Mm-hmm. And boy does color pop on that. Mm. Right. Uncoated. Yep. Absorbs the paper. Yep. Colors get flat. Yep. On that. Right, right. You've got satin, which is a nice in between, but things don't shine on. Sha Satin.
Massimo: Shotton. Shotton, William
Shawn: Shotton. I mean the sound like Sean Connery there,
Massimo: but it's true, right? Like satin paper, it's, it's got a nice look to it. Yes. But still colors are very flat. Right? Right. So again, there's so much, and then, and then you've got different qualities of paper, right? Some are thicker, some are thin.
Massimo: So you have to understand that. Every piece of paper affects the final outcome, the final output that [00:50:00] you're printing on. Right. Whether it's at a laser printer, whether you're taking it to a small press, a laser press. Mm-hmm. Even large output, you know, you get different paper stocks or vinyls and it changes how something's gonna look.
Massimo: Yep. So make sure you understand what kind of paper you are requesting things to be
Shawn: printed on. Mm-hmm. That's the thing. When back in the old days of the newspaper, you used to do a. Beautiful ad for the client. Everything looked great. Oh God. And then shit all over newsprint, right? Like newsprint is the worst.
Shawn: The worst, worst.
Massimo: Just like
Shawn: did it just. Skull on It really was right. It was terrible. My, it was just like, my god, this this piece that you're so proud of and it just looks like crap in the paper. You're right. And you'd get
Massimo: that really
Shawn: great high resolution of what, what was the resolution? Like 1 50, 30?
Shawn: Was it one 50? Yeah, it was pretty, but, and it was half this stuff too back then, right?
Massimo: Yes. Yes. Yeah. See, that's, that's an art form now that's just trendy to put half tone effect on something. I know, right. But that's how things were printed before things
Shawn: were printed back then. Yeah. Yeah. That's a wholes crazy before
Massimo: my time.
Shawn: I know, right? Mm-hmm. But yeah, so [00:51:00] you're right. Absolutely. And, and you look like your, your our business cards, you know, the nice thick paper and Yep.
Massimo: Yep. Look so good. Oh my God. Right. You know, really if there's on an 11th to this or, or a 10 B, it's also, wait, wait. People understanding the paper weight of this, you know, the stock itself, right?
Massimo: Yes. Because you do have, like, you know, you got eight pound, you got 10 pound. Mm-hmm. You got 12, but then you've got, you know, the points, you know, and you've got card stock and that's the whole thing. And we probably should have covered that a little bit more. Well, but ultimately part two, you've got, you got card stock.
Massimo: Yeah. Right. And you've got what, the bond or just the regular paper pay, right? Yes. And again, yeah, exactly. I mean, those are the two. Generally I put everything on card. Yeah. When I send anything to print, I go a card and I go.
Shawn: Thick, heavy. Yeah. Yeah. You, you, my business cards, I know I 20 point,
Massimo: they're huge.
Massimo: They, they like weapons. Like the best ninja stars. Yeah, totally. Oh damn. But yeah, card stock is generally what you wanna stick with. Yes. Almost everywhere. Yes. Cool. All right. Well, and again, you know what, I know a lot of people probably dropped on this, you know, podcast early cuz they're like, [00:52:00] ah, I know all this stuff probably.
Massimo: But the reality is this is so important for every single graphic designer to know, because again, even though you might only touch print, 5% of the time, 10% of the time, 15% of the time. It's an important part of this space. It totally
Shawn: is. And this is the thing. It's like we're talking to our buddy Dave.
Shawn: Yep. You know, there's a resurgence with this kind of huge resurgence, hands on, old school printing, you know, with a, with a letter types and all that kind of stuff coming back Right. When, when we went to Hatch, that's. All they
Massimo: did. Right. Hatch is still in business, still doing they stuff. Huge name stuff.
Massimo: Yeah. So I mean, this is, this is an art
Shawn: form. It is an art form, and I don't think it'll
Massimo: ever go away. You know what I mean? Well, and again, there's always gonna be the difference between print and digital, no matter what. Digital's cool is convenient. It's, it's the world that we live in. Yeah. But dude, there's something so analog about paper.
Massimo: Yes. Right? Yes. It's warm. It's, there's something about picking up a magazine. Yes. Yes. I through it. It's the experience because it's so multi census. Yes. What are we getting right now? Right. We get sight, visual sound from [00:53:00] digital, you know, you're looking, you're hearing things. It's sometimes really fucking annoying if you, if you're on TikTok on a regular basis.
Massimo: Right. It's like there's so much short form stuff, but you know what, there's no, there's no short form in print. No, you have to. Pause and appreciate everything you've got. You're reading line after line, you're observing the images, you're flipping the page. Yes, you've got the same experience, but it's so much more tactile, so much more.
Massimo: Yes. It just touches
Shawn: the soul. It totally, and it's like those, uh, those old Volkswagen brochures, oh my God, I love those brochures. They were beautiful. It's like, you know, great artwork. That classic that goes hand in hand. With the kind, the print. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like the, the actual printed page. You know what I mean?
Shawn: You can see that digitally. Absolutely. And it doesn't resonate as well. Absolutely. As it does you holding it with this classic mid-century kind of design stuff. Right. Oh, I totally love that. I that, yeah. So I think that will, That will make a comeback. Print is
Massimo: coming back. It is. It will. Will it ever be the, the thing you have to remember is back when we started it was the only thing thing.
Massimo: It was the only [00:54:00] thing. Yeah. And now digital is so huge and there's so many advantages of digital, unfortunately, because it's quick and turnaround and you can change things on the fly. Yes. It kind of goes with that whole world right now, which, you know, we can't necessarily a good thing. No. You know, because you can appreciate print a lot more and when you're in a trade show, people aren't saying here, QR code, this QR codes are always on a printed piece, you know what I mean?
Massimo: And they take you off. They're, people do still appreciate prints. Yes, yes. And whether it's a banner stand, whether it's a trade show booth that obviously still needs print. Yep. Or whether it's brochures, car wraps, flyers, car wraps, you know, I mean, menus for restaurants. Right. There's a time and place for it and it's, it's to every graphic designer's best interest to know this ship very well.
Massimo: Yeah. True. So by all means, very true. Check out our friend Dave. Right. Check out the Print Design Academy. Design Academy, okay. And check out his podcast, the Quickie Podcast. And it's actually a graphic design podcast despite the name, the Quickie. Everybody loves a good
Shawn: right? So that's why you should listen to that
Massimo: sometimes it's pretty funny.
Massimo: Sher left me
Shawn: Oh my God, that's amazing.
Massimo: Oh, God. But, you know, check out, check out what, what he's got in place, get signed up and just follow him on Instagram again. It's just, it's, it's really cool and it's such a good mission. All designers. Oh, big time. Need to have this big time. And again, you can appreciate it that much more.
Massimo: Yes, yes. So, all
Shawn: right. Yeah, and there's really, as an old man ranting here, there's really no ex. Excuse for students coming in here and not knowing this kind of stuff. Oh, isn't that terrible? I hate to say that, but it's just kinda like it
Massimo: hurt print and I get that print. Do we use that
Shawn: still? We
Massimo: do a lot. A lot, yes.
Massimo: Like we're still prepping stuff for print. Yes. We're still understanding the basics. Yes. You know, when you know Illustrator has more than one color mode people, it actually has a c m Yk option.
Shawn: It does. It does. And it changes things. A good deal. It really, really, really
Massimo: does. Right. So you guys. Got to understand this and be prepared for it.
Massimo: Yeah. Cuz man, it's, it's to your best interest. A
Shawn: hundred percent. That's right. And exactly like we said in earlier podcasts, you know, you make yourself indispensable. Absolutely. Because you [00:56:00] know how to do this stuff. Cause when a client with their fancy new RGB logo mm-hmm. With these bright ass colors, get a print back going, what the
Massimo: Why? Oh my God, I hate that. Cause everybody's creating these logos with these I know. With these RGB or digital only colors. Exactly.
Shawn: Cause there's no All yes. Because there's no forethought to the printed piece anymore.
Massimo: Yeah, it's the first thing you need to ask is, are you ever going to print this? Are you ever gonna do this?
Massimo: You gonna print it on the side of a building on a
Shawn: car? Chance are yes, you are. Yes. Yes. So you really do have to think about this. You do need this kind of stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And, and, and I think you mentioned it, it's like a third of things maybe. You know what I mean? It's
Massimo: not, it's not high priority anymore.
Massimo: What's the industry though? Some industries are a lot more print,
Shawn: right? This is true. That's true.
Massimo: It's incredible to believe that some, I mean, look, look, look what I was reading before. That Giant catalog. Yeah. Right? Yes. And um, I'm not gonna tell
Shawn: you what
Massimo: it was for, but um, it was a giant print catalog.
Massimo: It was just industrial supply
Shawn: crap. It was really boring. I'm not gonna
Massimo: lie. But [00:57:00] I wanted to leave you in suspense. I just gonna say good old push cards, shells packing paper.
Shawn: Oh, it gets
Massimo: me hot. It's so hot. It's so hot. Oh shit, bud. I mean, again, they spend a. Fortune on that catalog is true. Right. And it's,
Shawn: and you still get it.
Shawn: Yeah. Right. Absolutely. It's probably been delivered
Massimo: here for years. Right? It has. Right. Exactly. And it's true. It's it, the shit still exists. So
Shawn: yes, we all will, we will always, you know, crave holding something. Yeah. Absolutely. Into page. I think. Absolutely. This is good. This is a good thing, but we really, you know, we should be aware of what goes into the print Absolutely.
Shawn: At the beginning stages. Cool. Yeah.
Massimo: All right, buddy. Yeah, that was really good. Well, I mean, again, it was, it was a little educational. Yeah. Little learned educational. Sean learned something.
Shawn: I know what a four is for a four
Massimo: Damnit all these years, and I thought they were, I thought
Shawn: they were just fucking with me.
Shawn: Yeah, you're just, you're looking at this. It's like, what the hell is he? Who would you use this [00:58:00] shit? Why is this on here?
Massimo: I know, right? Oh my God. Hi. There you go. Now we know. Now I know. IO two
Shawn: 16. Do you think there's people in in Europe going, what the fuck is this? 11 by 17. What is a letter paid? Litter
Shawn: Probably. Yeah, definitely there is. Oh, you North Maryland. Well, now they know. Now they know. Right.
Massimo: All right, well I hope you guys got something out of this. You know, leave us a message. Let us know if there's anything else you missed or anything else we missed, or by all means, if there's anything we should add in the future on this list if we build it.
Massimo: Yeah. And also, We wanna know about your print a venture. Yes. Right. Let me know all the different ways that, you know, obviously if you're package design, you're doing print all the time, but I'm sure there are other ways other than the norms. Yeah. So we'd love to hear Yeah. How you guys are actually using print and where you encounter it.
Massimo: Right. Yeah. Because this stuff is very important for you guys. Yeah, totally. Hit us up on Instagram. We, um, we're pretty active there, you know, we're, we're hitting up with people. We're hitting up responses. But we're also pretty active on [00:59:00] YouTube as of late, right? So, you know, we've got some short form stuff.
Massimo: We've got lots of long form, you know, and it's growing. So hit us up over there and you can see, you know, these, these, these, these, I don't even know what to call us, but you can actually
Shawn: get a look at what we got going on here, and then you can like, go back to the podcast, go back.
Massimo: Let's go back to just listening to them.
Massimo: All right, everybody.
Shawn: My name is Mossy Mo. Hey, my name is Sean. Stay creative and stay angry.